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he says because we're at the zero balance, interest rates were zero, the effect of the fiscal cliff is getting much worse than if the fed were not at zero. >> because they could do something. >> the only positive thing which dudley did not talk about but it is something that's on the radar is that, as the fiscal cliff fears rise, interest rates fall on the 10-year. so the effect the fed would have from easing is already in -- already happening as a market reaction. >> steve, thank you. >>> when jeff kilburg is not fired up about the irish he is fired up about what mr. dudley said today. why? >> absolutely. he came out with very dovish comments. he lass a permanent vote and he is quite the confidant of ben bernanke. so he flat-out gave a wink-wink, there's something big coming in less than two weeks. >> he's been a dove for a long time though. no change but just to hear it articulated gives you some sense of -- >> it does. this could be a one-two punch. if the fomc comes out with additional measures, subsequent week later, all of a sudden they have the fiscal cliff resolution, bam, we c
he says because we're at the zero balance, interest rates were zero, the effect of the fiscal cliff is getting much worse than if the fed were not at zero. >> because they could do something. >> the only positive thing which dudley did not talk about but it is something that's on the radar is that, as the fiscal cliff fears rise, interest rates fall on the 10-year. so the effect the fed would have from easing is already in -- already happening as a market reaction. >> steve,...
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Nov 29, 2012
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. >> we're ready to protect middle-class families from the fiscal cliff that they're facing by freezing the tax rates for the first $250,000 of all americans' income. letting the rates go up to the same level they were during the clinton administration. republicans know where we stand. we've said it. we've said it. we've said it so many times. the president said the same thing. it's been weeks, at least two weeks, since we met at the white house. we're still waiting for a serious offer from the republicans. really, now is the time for the republicans to move past this happy talk about revenues, ill-defined, of course, and put specifics on the table. the president has made his proposal. we need a proposal from them. i'm glad to see there are some reasonable republicans breaking from the pack. veteran representative cole and a new member, scott from south carolina, have said basically the same thing. and that is, they should bring to the floor of the house the bill that's passed over here. it would pass overwhelmingly, as scott said in the press today. our bill would pass in a matter of m
. >> we're ready to protect middle-class families from the fiscal cliff that they're facing by freezing the tax rates for the first $250,000 of all americans' income. letting the rates go up to the same level they were during the clinton administration. republicans know where we stand. we've said it. we've said it. we've said it so many times. the president said the same thing. it's been weeks, at least two weeks, since we met at the white house. we're still waiting for a serious offer...
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Dec 4, 2012
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cliff and also because the marginal tax rates are going to automatically increase, which means any lower tax rates president obama will ask for is tax cuts and not an argument you are raising taxes on someone. for all those reasons, the democrats have a lot of leverage in january but that does not mean the democrats should wait till january, what happens after december 31st is everybody can lose. the kind of pressure we have psychologically and politically right now to get a deal done before we hit 2013, that kind of pressure and deadline pressure and momentum you're not going to have after you're over the fiscal cliff. so every day that goes by after january 1st isn't going to look like that big of a deal and essentially, time will run out for both parties, you will have a lot of problems in 2013, they will take the lion's share away from fiscal dealmaking, senate confirmation, have the debt ceiling, the long-delayed nuclear negotiableses with iran, going to have posturing for the 2014 campaigns. all of those things are going to suck out the moment up that we have right now. so, yes, de
cliff and also because the marginal tax rates are going to automatically increase, which means any lower tax rates president obama will ask for is tax cuts and not an argument you are raising taxes on someone. for all those reasons, the democrats have a lot of leverage in january but that does not mean the democrats should wait till january, what happens after december 31st is everybody can lose. the kind of pressure we have psychologically and politically right now to get a deal done before we...
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Nov 29, 2012
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. >> faced with the prospect of going over the fiscal cliff, which you just called serious business, or extending the lower tax rates and not the upper ones, which one would you choose? >> i'm going to do everything i can to avoid putting the american economy, the american people, through the fiasco of going over the fiscal cliff. >> which is worse, though, for the economy? >> what's that point of balance you just spoke about? could you put a debt limit increase in the overall package? >> as i told the president a couple weeks ago, there's a lot of things i've wanted in my life. but almost all of them had a price tag attached to them. and if we're going to talk about the debt limit in this, then we're probably -- there's going to be some price tag associated with it. >> last question. >> are you standing by your dollar for dollar -- >> i continue to believe that any increase in the debt limit has to be accompanied by spending reductions of that -- that meet or exceed it. >> thank you. >> with that, the happy talk azharry reid called it the other day is basically a thing of the past.
. >> faced with the prospect of going over the fiscal cliff, which you just called serious business, or extending the lower tax rates and not the upper ones, which one would you choose? >> i'm going to do everything i can to avoid putting the american economy, the american people, through the fiasco of going over the fiscal cliff. >> which is worse, though, for the economy? >> what's that point of balance you just spoke about? could you put a debt limit increase in the...
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Nov 29, 2012
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we go over the fiscal cliff rates reset under bill clinton and you're negotiating a tax cut not a tax increase. other thing the way weight of public opinion since that level has moved strongly against republicans. look who the public says they're going to blame if we go over the cliff, it's republicans because they see them as having forced the issue last time around, been willing to do this this time around. one reason boehner is grumbly and nervous because he doesn't have any leverage. >> i want to point this out. this is interesting in terms of the smoke and mirrors how this will play out for the republicans. in the "wall street journal" they write obama's flexible on highest tax rates. white house's flexibility, described by bowls, confirmed by the administration officials, could envision tax rates -- tax rate increase from the current level but was less than clinton era levels. if the republicans can say, we cut taxes from where they were under clinton it gives them cover though rates may go up. a weird, if there is an act of kabuki theater that would be it, right. >> i see a par
we go over the fiscal cliff rates reset under bill clinton and you're negotiating a tax cut not a tax increase. other thing the way weight of public opinion since that level has moved strongly against republicans. look who the public says they're going to blame if we go over the cliff, it's republicans because they see them as having forced the issue last time around, been willing to do this this time around. one reason boehner is grumbly and nervous because he doesn't have any leverage....
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will the white house let our economy go over the fiscal cliff if a deal on higher tax rates for the wealthy is not reached? we're checking it out. back in a moment. [ male announcer ] research suggests cell health plays a key role throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multivitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. it has 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. it's easy to follow the progress you're making toward all your financial goals. a quick glance, and you can see if you're on track. when the conversation turns to knowing where you stand, turn to us. wells fargo advisors. >>> welcome back. this very public negotiation on the fiscal cliff still does not seem to be closing in on a deal. the white house out in campaign style events regularly, making multiple media appearances, kle including timothy geithner right here in 25 minutes. >> but would things be done faster if it was done privately? in his latest column, jeff goldfor a compares u.s. budget talks to merger proxy battles. jeff joins us to explain about that. plus, we have bob from
will the white house let our economy go over the fiscal cliff if a deal on higher tax rates for the wealthy is not reached? we're checking it out. back in a moment. [ male announcer ] research suggests cell health plays a key role throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multivitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. it has 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. it's easy to follow the progress you're making toward all your financial goals. a...
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Dec 6, 2012
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. >> if republicans do not agree to that, is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff in. >> absolutely. there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. it's only 2%. >> i want to bring in "usa today" bureau chief and welcome to both of you. where are we in these negotiations, susan? >> i think the most encouraging thing was they agreed to the to characterize the phone call. the last time around the characterization of the phone call became a controversy in itself. i think it's pretty clear that the white house and republicans think the white house hand on this is strengthening. we see the polls that you mention, pew polls this week say americans trust the president more, assume if a deal is not reached -- trust the white house more, think if a deal isn't reached it, will be the fault of republicans and it is in fact easier for democrats to go over the fiscal cliff than it is for republicans because then all those tax cuts from the republicans are swept away. but it's too early. it's only december 6. we've
. >> if republicans do not agree to that, is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff in. >> absolutely. there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. it's only 2%. >> i want to bring in "usa today" bureau chief and welcome to both of you. where are we in these negotiations, susan? >> i think the most encouraging thing was they agreed to the to characterize the phone call. the last...
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we are going over the fiscal cliff, that's my take. the administration is not budging. the only way they will even come to the table to negotiate is with the top earners paying higher tax rates, not just more in taxes, higher tax rates. but for some reason it must be higher rates, period. that's it. end of story. not because it is going to move the needle and fix our out of control debt, because it won't, not because it will put america on a fiscal sustainable path, because it won't. that is where the president has drawn his line in the sand. meanwhile, the president is now proposing a form of kicking the can down the road. raising taxes now with a promise to deal with entitlement reform and tax reform next year or beyond. that's the real worrisome proposal. here we are at the center of probably the most important fiscal conversation this country has had in decades. no one thinks we can continue on this spending path we are on without a day of reckoning coming sooner or later. why would we not seize the
we are going over the fiscal cliff, that's my take. the administration is not budging. the only way they will even come to the table to negotiate is with the top earners paying higher tax rates, not just more in taxes, higher tax rates. but for some reason it must be higher rates, period. that's it. end of story. not because it is going to move the needle and fix our out of control debt, because it won't, not because it will put america on a fiscal sustainable path, because it won't. that is...
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the fiscal cliff. two former governors will offer their perspective. plus, more on what bank of america's brian moynihan told becky this morning. more "squawk on the street" in just a moment. try running four.ning a restaurant is hard, fortunately we've got ink. it gives us 5x the rewards on our internet, phone charges and cable, plus at office supply stores. rewards we put right back into our business. this is the only thing we've ever wanted to do and ink helps us do it. make your mark with ink from chase. you can stay in and share something... ♪ ♪ ...or you can get out there with your friends and actually share something. ♪ the lexus december to remember sales event is on, offering some of our best values of the year. this is the pursuit of perfection. offering some of our best values of the year. i have obligations. cute tobligations, but obligations.g. i need to rethink the core of my portfolio. what i really need is sleep. introducing the ishares core, building blocks for the heart of your
the fiscal cliff. two former governors will offer their perspective. plus, more on what bank of america's brian moynihan told becky this morning. more "squawk on the street" in just a moment. try running four.ning a restaurant is hard, fortunately we've got ink. it gives us 5x the rewards on our internet, phone charges and cable, plus at office supply stores. rewards we put right back into our business. this is the only thing we've ever wanted to do and ink helps us do it. make your...
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and as you know, this isn't one fiscal cliff. this is six or seven different things that can be taken on one at a time. the middle class and the working class can be protected. the only thing preventing that from happening is the house leadership. and that's a tough situation for the republicans to be in, where they either have to show their true priority, which is to hold the middle class hostage, or take this piece away and be forced to show what they're really standing for. >> but if you look at the fish bowl the republicans are swimming in right now, there are a lot of sharks. you've got mitch mcconnell, who's running for re-election. you've got eric cantor, looking over speaker boehner's shoulder. he'd love to have that job. i mean, how can you get an honest broker out of the republican camp, when all of this stuff is swimming around? you've got the hard right-wing tea partyers out there. you've got mcconnell looking at possibly being in a real tough re-election. and as i said, you know, boehner, is he protecting his backsid
and as you know, this isn't one fiscal cliff. this is six or seven different things that can be taken on one at a time. the middle class and the working class can be protected. the only thing preventing that from happening is the house leadership. and that's a tough situation for the republicans to be in, where they either have to show their true priority, which is to hold the middle class hostage, or take this piece away and be forced to show what they're really standing for. >> but if...
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let's hope we don't go over that fiscal cliff. >> fingers crossed they will reach a compromise. i don't think there's anyone out there that wants to see us go over that fiscal cliff. >> that would be bad. but the clock is ticking. only a few weeks left. >>> the biggest problem between the united states and mexico and how to solve it. i'll speak with mexico's new president. my exclusive interview is just ahead. this line is a convenienc. how you doing today? i'm good thanks. how are you? i'm good. [ gordon ] but for others, it's all they can afford. every day nearly nine million older americans don't have enough to eat. anything else? no, not today. join me, aarp, and aarp foundation in the drive to end hunger by visiting drivetoendhunger.org. i tell them dentures are very different to real teeth. they're about 10 times softer and may have surface pores where bacteria can grow and multiply. polident is specifically designed to clean dentures daily. its unique micro-clean formula kills 99.9% of odor causing bacteria and helps dissolve stains, cleaning in a better way than brushing
let's hope we don't go over that fiscal cliff. >> fingers crossed they will reach a compromise. i don't think there's anyone out there that wants to see us go over that fiscal cliff. >> that would be bad. but the clock is ticking. only a few weeks left. >>> the biggest problem between the united states and mexico and how to solve it. i'll speak with mexico's new president. my exclusive interview is just ahead. this line is a convenienc. how you doing today? i'm good thanks....
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you've got to be for a tax rate increase or we will go over this fiscal cliff. >> no, you don't. you could raise from a carbon tax of $20 a ton, which will deal with, we are having the biggest record carbon levels. you could raise -- at 4% a year over the next ten year, twice as much as you could from allowing the bush tax rates to lapse. why the income tax system is overburdened in the united states. we use it too much. we should be looking at other taxes. we can't do it in 29 days. why are we doing it in 29 days? >> but the president ran on raises taxes, right? if you look at the polls. 60% of people support raising taxes on people who make over $250,000 a year. how much of a problem is it, david, if the republicans you know, tom coburn said he does not want to raise that tax number. >> the president ran on his first term on opposing a health care mandate. presidents change their minds. the idea that you would do a revenue measure with an eye to basically doing something punitive, when there are much more important policy goals you can achieve and when it's not going to be good
you've got to be for a tax rate increase or we will go over this fiscal cliff. >> no, you don't. you could raise from a carbon tax of $20 a ton, which will deal with, we are having the biggest record carbon levels. you could raise -- at 4% a year over the next ten year, twice as much as you could from allowing the bush tax rates to lapse. why the income tax system is overburdened in the united states. we use it too much. we should be looking at other taxes. we can't do it in 29 days. why...
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the biggest issue that's causing the fiscal cliff is the tax rates going up on the middle class. especially in this time now when we're getting out of this recession. we're seeing some robust growth. we want the christmas sales to be good. if the middle class knew that they're going to keep their tax cut, it would put a smile on everybody's face. and both parties can take credit for it. why won't they do it? there's only one answer. they're obsessed with protecting billionaires and millionaires. it's a sad state of affairs. >> one thing that we've seen in the days leading up, at least through this week, that there has been optimism from both sides expressed by speaker boehner, also by the president, and also republican tom cole, congre congressman, seem to be on board. now we have conservatives like charles krauthammer putting out their pieces saying let's go over the fiscal cliff, let the president do this. then john cornyn, republican from texas, saying apparently the president wants us to go over the fiscal cliff. this is serious business, demanding higher taxes, more stimulus
the biggest issue that's causing the fiscal cliff is the tax rates going up on the middle class. especially in this time now when we're getting out of this recession. we're seeing some robust growth. we want the christmas sales to be good. if the middle class knew that they're going to keep their tax cut, it would put a smile on everybody's face. and both parties can take credit for it. why won't they do it? there's only one answer. they're obsessed with protecting billionaires and...
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Dec 6, 2012
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in a fiscal cliff free fall, tax rates on capital gains could rise to 24%. those dividends could increase to a whopping 44%. here now is former reagan economic adviser art laugher. how can you have capitalism without capital and why is there a war on capital, that includes cap gains, that includes dividends which will triple. it also includes the estate tax. why is there a war on capital? >> i have no idea, larry. i think it's just pure politics. but it's sort of lovely the words and looking them up. i understand that the french don't have a word for entrepreneur or laissez faire. [ laughter ] >> because they never use it. >> they never use it. economics is all about incentives. if you tax people who work, you pay people who don't work, don't be surprised if you find a lot of people not working. it's the rich issue here, which is just fascinating to me. if you tax rich people and give the money to poor people, you're going to get lots and lots of poor people and very few rich people. just look at what happened in britain two years ago when gordon brown raise
in a fiscal cliff free fall, tax rates on capital gains could rise to 24%. those dividends could increase to a whopping 44%. here now is former reagan economic adviser art laugher. how can you have capitalism without capital and why is there a war on capital, that includes cap gains, that includes dividends which will triple. it also includes the estate tax. why is there a war on capital? >> i have no idea, larry. i think it's just pure politics. but it's sort of lovely the words and...
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if not, don't adjust your entire investment philosophy just because of the fiscal cliff. >> craig, you're the patient value investor. are you standing aside, waiting for this to resolve itself? >> you know, we use the volatility, the fiscal cliff to buy great businesses that are on sale. you know, the fact remains that the stocks are extremely underowned like i've never seen. i saw the other day, in 2006 pensions and endowments had about 60% of their enveinvestme in equities. that's down to under 35% in most cases. you also had four years of the much yul fund li mutual fund liquidations. i don't think the market is at great risk here. stay with domestic companies. stay with companies that have real high barriers of entry that are kpacheap. if you get caught up in the day to day news flow, you can get whipped in and out. the fiscal cliff will be resolved, whether it's two weeks or a month and a half. the market will move around, but long term it looks good. >> the question s how will it be resolved? jeff cox, already we are seeing a movement on the part of investors to say, if i'm sitting
if not, don't adjust your entire investment philosophy just because of the fiscal cliff. >> craig, you're the patient value investor. are you standing aside, waiting for this to resolve itself? >> you know, we use the volatility, the fiscal cliff to buy great businesses that are on sale. you know, the fact remains that the stocks are extremely underowned like i've never seen. i saw the other day, in 2006 pensions and endowments had about 60% of their enveinvestme in equities. that's...
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joining me is bob casey who is moderating the hearing on the fiscal cliff next week. sir, i start with the comparison of the two plans so everyone can see this. the gop plan through closing loopholes and no deductions and rate hikes, as we pointed out as exposed under the democratic plan. the republican plan includes more entitlements through republican reform and then eligibility age being raised than the gop plan including changes of social security not addressed under the president's plan. so these plans, obviously, to the naked eye, they deliver greatly. no matter what con eggs sessions will be made on oert side, explain where you see the sensible center. >> first of all, that plan makes no sense because it forgets about and casts aside the most important focus we've got to bring to this, is what happens to middle income families. that's where the house should pass the legislation. we've already passed. give some certainty. get that part of the deal done. then we can have a debate about upper income folks. the idea that you have a bill in the house that will prote
joining me is bob casey who is moderating the hearing on the fiscal cliff next week. sir, i start with the comparison of the two plans so everyone can see this. the gop plan through closing loopholes and no deductions and rate hikes, as we pointed out as exposed under the democratic plan. the republican plan includes more entitlements through republican reform and then eligibility age being raised than the gop plan including changes of social security not addressed under the president's plan....
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with things like the fiscal cliff coming up and a radical change in tax rates and possible future growth rates, i just think there are going to be lots of decisions that need to be made. lots of interesting decisions that aren't just m&a. corporate boards need advice on that. i'm optimistic it will be a decent year. >> we hope to visit you during that year. thank you. >> back to you, melissa. >>> news for investors out there. let's send it to mary thompson for a market flash. >> cnbc obtaining a notice that the company is raising margin requirements for apple to 60% from 30% effective at midnight tonight. one thing we want to note is cnbc has spoken to other people on the equity desk. they say they are not planning to follow the raise of margin on requirements for apple. we want to note that core clearing will issue a statement on this later. back to you. >> all right. thank you very much, mary thompson. still ahead, live coverage of president obama's remarks on the fiscal cliff before the business roundtable. can the president convince corporate america that he's got the right solution
with things like the fiscal cliff coming up and a radical change in tax rates and possible future growth rates, i just think there are going to be lots of decisions that need to be made. lots of interesting decisions that aren't just m&a. corporate boards need advice on that. i'm optimistic it will be a decent year. >> we hope to visit you during that year. thank you. >> back to you, melissa. >>> news for investors out there. let's send it to mary thompson for a market...
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the "news nation" is following where things regard right now with the fiscal cliff and there's hot rhetoric to go around. >> our members believe strongly that raising tax rates will hurt the economy. closing loopholes, especially on those who are wealthy, is a better way to raise this revenue. >> in order for us to raise the amount of revenue that's needed just by closing deductions and loopholes for high earners we'd have to, for example, eliminate or severely cap the char itible deduction. >> an obsession to raise taxes not going to solve the problem. what will solve the problem is doing something about the entitlements, taking on the wasteful spending in washington. >> and meantime, "the new york times" jonathan wiseman reports behind the scene republican leaders are considering the president's plan to extend middle class tax cuts now an address the debt and spending in the new year. here's republican senator tom coburn on "morning joe." >> actually, i would rather see the rates go up than the other way and greater chance to broaden the base in the future. >> do something, a down payment
the "news nation" is following where things regard right now with the fiscal cliff and there's hot rhetoric to go around. >> our members believe strongly that raising tax rates will hurt the economy. closing loopholes, especially on those who are wealthy, is a better way to raise this revenue. >> in order for us to raise the amount of revenue that's needed just by closing deductions and loopholes for high earners we'd have to, for example, eliminate or severely cap the...
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a very stark assessment from the house speaker on where the fiscal cliff talks stand with 24 days to go. where should you put your money heading into this weekend? could be a very crucial weekend. >>> no worries. with the unemployment rate still near an 8% level, why some companies can't find workers. there's work and it is not a skills gap. we'll show you what else is being factored in to that equation. >>> and no fair, perhaps? well, a big change at big blue. ibm changing the way it pays down its 401(k). will other companies follow suit? tyler mathisen, my partner, who is always fair, always working, and is always a work in progress, according to this, is at new york stock exchange. hi, ty. >> i am the ultimate work in progress. thank you very much. >>> despite the assessment from the speaker of the house on the fiscal cliff, the fact he says there is no progress being made so far, the dow sort of playing past it. right now the industrials up by 46 points at 13,120 and change. apple is part of the nasdaq. apple down $14 a share. another 2.66% today as scott mentioned a moment ago,
a very stark assessment from the house speaker on where the fiscal cliff talks stand with 24 days to go. where should you put your money heading into this weekend? could be a very crucial weekend. >>> no worries. with the unemployment rate still near an 8% level, why some companies can't find workers. there's work and it is not a skills gap. we'll show you what else is being factored in to that equation. >>> and no fair, perhaps? well, a big change at big blue. ibm changing...
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we go over the fiscal cliff small business owners could see the tax rates rise to over 50 percent. >> it is eye popping isn't it. pray congress makes a deal to avoid going over the fiscal cliff. high income workers there will get more than 50 percent. it targets income brackets. state taxes went up. they are now higher than both new york city as well as hawaii. >> when it comes to jobs being added different numbers, 118,000. >> this is the first week of the month we get a lot of jobs data. storm event coming in when i say storm literally we will see the effects of super storm sandy. private job creation says businesses added 118,000 jobs in november. if it were not for sandy that number would have been north of 200,000. adt may have a stronger jobs report that's the big one economists look at. we expect 93,000 nonfarm jobs have been created last month. the numbers are weak and they suggest it's not just a storm but it is worried about the fiscal cliff holding businesses back from hiring. >> business owners and other people on e-mail which is most of us. when you are reading the e-mail
we go over the fiscal cliff small business owners could see the tax rates rise to over 50 percent. >> it is eye popping isn't it. pray congress makes a deal to avoid going over the fiscal cliff. high income workers there will get more than 50 percent. it targets income brackets. state taxes went up. they are now higher than both new york city as well as hawaii. >> when it comes to jobs being added different numbers, 118,000. >> this is the first week of the month we get a lot...
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that's the whole issue here. >> on the fiscal cliff front, no new deals or concessions made public, but "the new york times" reports the dynamic has changed. at the request of speaker boehner, senate leaders and nancy pelosi have been dismissed from the negotiating table. leaving just the speaker and the president to hammer this one out. today vice president biden is hosting middle-class families at the white house, continuing to pressure congress to strike a deal on tax rates below 250,000. yesterday, the president struck a hopeful note with a middle-income family in virginia, while maintaining a hardline on negotiations. >> the message that i think we all want to send to members of congress is, this is a sovble problem. i'm not going to sign any package that somehow prevents the top rate from going up for rate at the top 2% but i remain optimistic we can get something done for that is good for families like this one and that is good for the american economy. >> but the clock is ticking. with just two full weeks before christmas to go. joining me now from washington, the man with all t
that's the whole issue here. >> on the fiscal cliff front, no new deals or concessions made public, but "the new york times" reports the dynamic has changed. at the request of speaker boehner, senate leaders and nancy pelosi have been dismissed from the negotiating table. leaving just the speaker and the president to hammer this one out. today vice president biden is hosting middle-class families at the white house, continuing to pressure congress to strike a deal on tax rates...
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cliff policies and they made a projection that while 2013, if all of the fiscal cliff things and all is enacted in congress and you do nothing to stop the tax rate increases for everybody, 2013 will be bad but by 2018 and 2020 we will be a better did debt to gdp ratio than we've had in decades, that we will be running budget surpluses and we'll be full deployment. do you believe the analysis of the fiscal cliff impact was too rosy? >> projections are very difficult. it's very difficult to take into account the effect on confidence. as i said, consumers have been confident. they've maintained that confidence. but look at what happened during the debt limit debacle a year ago august. look at how the economy came to a grinding halt at that point. >> and that's your fear that the cliff could just freeze consume earp confidence and that's something you can't right now project as an economist? >> no one wants to go over the fiscal cliff. worse would be for the president to sign a bad bill. >> all right. alan krueger, chairman of the president's counscil on economi advisers. mr. krueger, ni
cliff policies and they made a projection that while 2013, if all of the fiscal cliff things and all is enacted in congress and you do nothing to stop the tax rate increases for everybody, 2013 will be bad but by 2018 and 2020 we will be a better did debt to gdp ratio than we've had in decades, that we will be running budget surpluses and we'll be full deployment. do you believe the analysis of the fiscal cliff impact was too rosy? >> projections are very difficult. it's very difficult to...
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see what he thinks about the fiscal cliff. >>> later on in the program, with the rush to sell high-end homes to take advantage of this year's lower tax rates, is it a good time now to snap them up? our wealth editor robert frank. plus, our real estate correspondent will tell you what you need to know back half of the show. don't miss it. >>> and here's a lye shot of the street outside the new york stock exchange. christmas tree is right behind the band there. they are ready for the tree lighting ceremony. expect it to take place about an hour from now. we'll take you there live. back in a moment. obligations. obligations. i need to rethink the core of my portfolio. what i really need is sleep. introducing the ishares core, building blocks for the heart of your portfolio. find out why 9 out of 10 large professional investors choose ishares for their etfs. ishares by blackrock. call 1-800-ishares for a prospectus which includes investment objectives, risks, charges and expenses. read and consider it carefully before investing. risk includes possible loss of principal. music is a universa
see what he thinks about the fiscal cliff. >>> later on in the program, with the rush to sell high-end homes to take advantage of this year's lower tax rates, is it a good time now to snap them up? our wealth editor robert frank. plus, our real estate correspondent will tell you what you need to know back half of the show. don't miss it. >>> and here's a lye shot of the street outside the new york stock exchange. christmas tree is right behind the band there. they are ready...
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fortunate americans and others to avoid the fiscal cliff between now and december 31st but take what we agree on which is that the middle class tax cuts should be extended and tax rates should not go up for the middle class, let's do that now. the republicans refuse to do that thus far, which is sort of baffling. even some of their senior members like tom cole from oklahoma have said let's take that deal, but let's pass the tax cuts for the middle class and we're talking about making sure that tax rates for 98% of all americans and 97% of all businesses. it's a small percentage of individuals that make more than $250,000 a year that tax rates would go up just a little bit. we had an election, thomas, where americans had a clear choice and they chose and we need to make sure that we think a balanced approach that is fair, that doesn't throw the middle class under the bus and that works mathematically. so far what we've seen from republicans in the house does not work in terms of reducing the deficit. >> congresswoman, we are watching the president on our screen at the business roundta
fortunate americans and others to avoid the fiscal cliff between now and december 31st but take what we agree on which is that the middle class tax cuts should be extended and tax rates should not go up for the middle class, let's do that now. the republicans refuse to do that thus far, which is sort of baffling. even some of their senior members like tom cole from oklahoma have said let's take that deal, but let's pass the tax cuts for the middle class and we're talking about making sure that...
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and timothy geithner has told the cnbc the swhous ready to go over the fiscal cliff if tax rates on the nation's wealthiest don't rise. dag gri announces the rate decision later about plus apple shares still down in frankfurt. and its shares of the chinese market drop in the third quarter. >>> deutsche bank has hit back at allegations of financial impropriety brought by three former employees. according to reports, the ex-deutsche workers have launched a complaint with u.s. authorities alleging the bank failed to recognize $12 billion in unrealized losses at the height of the financial crisis. they claim improper accounting on the part of the deutsche bank enabled the lender to exaggerate its capital position. and citigroup plans to shed 11,000 jobs around the world which equals around 4% of its workforce. some experts say this is part of a strategy led by their new coe who took job in october, however others say it has the finger prints of chairman michael o'neal. citi shares reacted positively to the news, though the stockstill trading at around 70% of its tangible book value. you can
and timothy geithner has told the cnbc the swhous ready to go over the fiscal cliff if tax rates on the nation's wealthiest don't rise. dag gri announces the rate decision later about plus apple shares still down in frankfurt. and its shares of the chinese market drop in the third quarter. >>> deutsche bank has hit back at allegations of financial impropriety brought by three former employees. according to reports, the ex-deutsche workers have launched a complaint with u.s. authorities...
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lost it's favored credit rating. they say the economy's actually expanding, but they're still really worried about, you know, the fiscal cliff. >>> and now our fourth story "outfront" for the second day in a row, susan rice met with republican senators, some of whom obviously have harshly criticized her for ther handlin of the attack in benghazi. the moderate susan collins spoke to us. >> i continue to be troubled by the fact that the u.n. ambassador decided to play what was essentially a political role at the height of a contentious presidential election campaign. >> yet the president continues to stand by susan rice. >> susan rice is extraordinary. couldn't be prouder of the job that she's done at the u.n. >> all right, tim, when you hear senator collins, you know, she is influential, she is moderate, come out and say look, i'm not satisfied, sort of turning her back on susan rice, she had the moment in front of the microphone to endorse, she did not. should the administration cut its losses and say this might not
lost it's favored credit rating. they say the economy's actually expanding, but they're still really worried about, you know, the fiscal cliff. >>> and now our fourth story "outfront" for the second day in a row, susan rice met with republican senators, some of whom obviously have harshly criticized her for ther handlin of the attack in benghazi. the moderate susan collins spoke to us. >> i continue to be troubled by the fact that the u.n. ambassador decided to play...
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Nov 30, 2012
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comment on the fiscal cliff. headline -- john boehner calling the white house's most recent offer not a serious proposal reiterating the fact that is he willing to put revenues on the table but not through a raise in the tax rates, by closing loopholes. he wants lower tax rates. reiterating the republican position there. harold ford jr., the former democratic congressman, also doug holtz-eakin is the former congressional budget office director. keith banks is here with us as well. harold, your reaction to what the house speaker says here? certainly doesn't seem, if you listen to either the president or the speaker, that we're any closer to a deal. >> i was encouraged by the speaker's remarks. he didn't put his foot down and say no adamantly or irretrievably to anything. whether asked specifically if rate increases were something he could support, he suggested that there were other means and other ways to achieve new revenue. a lot of ways i thought it was a measured response and we live to fight. those of us who
comment on the fiscal cliff. headline -- john boehner calling the white house's most recent offer not a serious proposal reiterating the fact that is he willing to put revenues on the table but not through a raise in the tax rates, by closing loopholes. he wants lower tax rates. reiterating the republican position there. harold ford jr., the former democratic congressman, also doug holtz-eakin is the former congressional budget office director. keith banks is here with us as well. harold, your...
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we have no idea where the capital gains are going to go, we're going to go over the fiscal cliff, what do you have to lose, the rates are going to go up. i don't think it makes any difference two tim geithner says. >> it is so widely held by so many who want to play the stock market, let's say, beyond just the capital gains, whether it's in taxable account organization not and it also has the psychological impact that this is the one that i'm going to get out of because i'm afraid of what's coming in general? >> this is the stock, yes, it's cheap, now once it goes down, we have a million reasons, well, it's a nokia phone, well, it's china. ipad miniis available. this is a stock that's so widely owned. it reminds me of sirius satellite. every doctor, every dentist owns apple. they don't know the price per share, they just know it is the proxy for the market. >> they just accelerated dividends. but i think we're talking now 150 companies in some fashion have accelerated or put forward a special dividend. you put forward a special market share, china is 76, with the market share at least.
we have no idea where the capital gains are going to go, we're going to go over the fiscal cliff, what do you have to lose, the rates are going to go up. i don't think it makes any difference two tim geithner says. >> it is so widely held by so many who want to play the stock market, let's say, beyond just the capital gains, whether it's in taxable account organization not and it also has the psychological impact that this is the one that i'm going to get out of because i'm afraid of...
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>> yeah. >> blake, if there is a deal to avoid the so-called fiscal cliff, could these jobs numbers get considerable better? >> i think so, but it's funny. the republicans are in a bit of a box here. their motivation is to say it's not so good. a lot of jobless people out there. we have a real problem. meanwhi meanwhile, we have fiscal cliff negotiations where the president wants stimulus mechanisms including an extension of unemployment insurance. they're like a doctor who diagnosed you with a severe ill sxns won't sign the precipitation to give you the medicine. they emphasize the joblessness problem, and they don't want to give you unemployment insurance and tell that to someone laid off sleeping in their car. >> with these jobs numbers, had hurricane sandy not struck how better would this report have been? >> a lot of this was construction job weakness. clearly, that will rebound. one of the unfortunate upsides of natural disaster is that you do, whether the states or federal governments do it or insurance companies, you have a lot of infrastructure spending as people rebuild from t
>> yeah. >> blake, if there is a deal to avoid the so-called fiscal cliff, could these jobs numbers get considerable better? >> i think so, but it's funny. the republicans are in a bit of a box here. their motivation is to say it's not so good. a lot of jobless people out there. we have a real problem. meanwhi meanwhile, we have fiscal cliff negotiations where the president wants stimulus mechanisms including an extension of unemployment insurance. they're like a doctor who...
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it's 30 days and counting until we go over the fiscal cliff. >> the president is demanding higher tax rates. congressional republicans want deeper spending cuts and entitlement reform. will they make a deal before we bring in the new year with a round of tax increases for all of us? we will ask the two men at the center of the negotiations where we really stand. for the president, treasury secretary timothy geithner. for the gop house speaker john boehner. geithner and boehner only on fox news sunday. plus, we've seen this movie before. the two parties edging closer and closer to the brink. we will ask our sunday panel whether we will get a happy ending or an economic disaster. and our power player of the week. a young beauty queen has to make a tough choice. all right now on fox news sunday. >> hello again from fox news in washington. well, we had quite a day around here friday with talks to avoid the fiscal cliff deadlock, and everyone saying the other side is to blame, pressure secretary geithner scheduled a ground of interviews. then friday afternoon, speaker boehner's office call
it's 30 days and counting until we go over the fiscal cliff. >> the president is demanding higher tax rates. congressional republicans want deeper spending cuts and entitlement reform. will they make a deal before we bring in the new year with a round of tax increases for all of us? we will ask the two men at the center of the negotiations where we really stand. for the president, treasury secretary timothy geithner. for the gop house speaker john boehner. geithner and boehner only on fox...
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cliff budget negotiations that as of this hour are still focused entirely on income tax rates. there is much more that congress has to solve than income tax rates including the amt, medicare spending, medicaid, and possibly social security. joining me to talk about the things that congress is not yet talking about but will soon be talking about, joeyç reed and chris hayes. chris, the amt has a deadline to it that is sharper than anything else in here, because these 2012 tax returns going to have to be calculated with either this new version of the amt or the fixed version, and that is the difference between it affects -- it adds tens of millions of people getting bitten by this thing. i know that the insiders are more worried about that actually getting fixed than the cliff at this point. >> yeah. when i started covering capitol hill in washington, there were two things that people talked about, which was the amt patch and the dock fix. everyone is like where are we on the amt fix. they adjust the payments and do this thing with the amt. we were asking early on, is there a wa
cliff budget negotiations that as of this hour are still focused entirely on income tax rates. there is much more that congress has to solve than income tax rates including the amt, medicare spending, medicaid, and possibly social security. joining me to talk about the things that congress is not yet talking about but will soon be talking about, joeyç reed and chris hayes. chris, the amt has a deadline to it that is sharper than anything else in here, because these 2012 tax returns going to...
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with the fiscal cliff three weeks away, it's absolutely crazy to be talking at that level of nonspecificity. and then, yes, you're right. you're talking about not just holding tax rates where they are, which wouldn't really work for high income people, but lowering tax rates and then making up your spending cuts by kicking the heck out of social insurance perhaps, medicare, medicaid, and social security. this is big time robin hood in reverse without any specifics at absolutely the worst time. >> professor peterson, grover norquist appears to think the president regards himself as a monarch preparing for coronation. take a listen to what he told my colleague, alex wagner, earlier today. >> and he thinks somebody made him king and he's going to have more taxes, more spending, and more regulations. it's a real problem for him. he doesn't have the mandate he thinks he does. so i think he takes us over the cliff because he doesn't -- he's got blinders on. he doesn't see where he stands in the universe. >> the president will take us over the cliff because he doesn't understand his place in the u
with the fiscal cliff three weeks away, it's absolutely crazy to be talking at that level of nonspecificity. and then, yes, you're right. you're talking about not just holding tax rates where they are, which wouldn't really work for high income people, but lowering tax rates and then making up your spending cuts by kicking the heck out of social insurance perhaps, medicare, medicaid, and social security. this is big time robin hood in reverse without any specifics at absolutely the worst time....
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but it's also important to remember that the fiscal cliff isn't only tax rates and spending cuts. the fiscal cliff also includes the nation's agriculture policy, which expires at the end of the year. it includes patches to medicare formulas. patches to social security formulas. so this is a huge mess of issues. we're not even talking about those issues yet. congressional negotiators and the white house aren't talking about these huge host of other issues that are on the table. the thought is if they can get past tax rates and spending cuts, then they will be able to deal with the peripheral issues. but we don't have much time. if a deal isn't reached or a framework isn't reached in the next week or, so it's going to be a big problem. >> all right, thanks for that. good to see you. > >>> nokia -- we'll tell you more when we come back in a few moments. [ male announcer ] this december, remember -- ♪ you can stay in and like something... ♪ [ car alarm deactivates ] ♪ ...or you can get out there with your family and actually like something. ♪ the lexus december to remember sal
but it's also important to remember that the fiscal cliff isn't only tax rates and spending cuts. the fiscal cliff also includes the nation's agriculture policy, which expires at the end of the year. it includes patches to medicare formulas. patches to social security formulas. so this is a huge mess of issues. we're not even talking about those issues yet. congressional negotiators and the white house aren't talking about these huge host of other issues that are on the table. the thought is if...
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two things, first of all, i actually think we're going to get a resolution to the fiscal cliff. i just think it's going to come after we go over. so that's not unlike -- >> we agree. >> the idea there is actually republicans can claim a tax decrease. that is you can take the rate down from 39.6% to 38% or 37%, something like that. the president gets what he wants, which is higher rates. the republicans can claim victory as well because they're lower than they would have been otherwise. >> tony, let's assume we do, in fact, go over the cliff. as both you and jerrod suggest that we likely will. the market will likely go down and go down hard. a new poll suggested if we do go over the cliff that republicans are going to be the ones who are going to be blamed. how will we deal with that with the market being held hostage by these negotiations which seemingly, at least in public, are going nowhere? >> first of all, i think the markets might be better to listen to me and jerrod rather than whoever is telling them this could absolutely get done and the republicans will cave and that's
two things, first of all, i actually think we're going to get a resolution to the fiscal cliff. i just think it's going to come after we go over. so that's not unlike -- >> we agree. >> the idea there is actually republicans can claim a tax decrease. that is you can take the rate down from 39.6% to 38% or 37%, something like that. the president gets what he wants, which is higher rates. the republicans can claim victory as well because they're lower than they would have been...
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as you think about the fiscal cliff and what is coming, one of the few places you can see people responding to it is in their behavior around capital gains and dividends. companies are moving up to how, shareholders take a vintage of a lower rate. i expect you will see more investors realize lower capital gains in order to get lower rates. there is clearly money there. there is clearly money that has interesting, distributional characteristics. that tends to be money that comes from higher income folks. as you think about the political process trying to structure when a package with a revenue goal and a distribution goal, my prediction is you will see at least some of those increases occur. i personally would be surprised if the dividend rate went back up to ordinary rates. the senate would allow it to stay at the capital gains rate, and go it to 15% to 20%. the president initially proposed cutting dividends they the same as capital gains. -- proposed letting dividends stay the same as capital gains. my guess would be that that is where we end up. >> what would you say is best? should the d
as you think about the fiscal cliff and what is coming, one of the few places you can see people responding to it is in their behavior around capital gains and dividends. companies are moving up to how, shareholders take a vintage of a lower rate. i expect you will see more investors realize lower capital gains in order to get lower rates. there is clearly money there. there is clearly money that has interesting, distributional characteristics. that tends to be money that comes from higher...
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insult and finger pointing in the fiscal cliff debate. tax rates spike and spending slashed. congress is breaking for the holidays in two weeks. it could send the economy spinning in directions. $1.6 trillion in tax hikes. he will travel to pennsylvania to sell it to you. republicans aren't buying it. listen to house speaker, john boehner. >> despite the claims the president supports a balanced approach, the democrats have yet to get serious about real spending cuts. >> democrats are firing right back at boehner. harry reid getting a little personal. >> i don't understand his brain, so you should ask him. okay? >> ouch. athena jones live from washington. same old same old. where do we go from here? >> that's the big question. the nice talk after the election is pretty much gone away. you mentioned one of the big sticking points, that's taxes. republicans and democrats can't agree on how to raise the tax revenue? end the bush tax cuts for the wealthy, close the loopholes, raise the capital gains taxes or all of the above. right now, they can't agree on how much money should be
insult and finger pointing in the fiscal cliff debate. tax rates spike and spending slashed. congress is breaking for the holidays in two weeks. it could send the economy spinning in directions. $1.6 trillion in tax hikes. he will travel to pennsylvania to sell it to you. republicans aren't buying it. listen to house speaker, john boehner. >> despite the claims the president supports a balanced approach, the democrats have yet to get serious about real spending cuts. >> democrats...
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cliff. earlier today, president obama brought the debt ceiling debate, or would be debate into the picture. it feels like a lot of the work that you do -- people say okay, we spent 100 grand on this or maybe watching the shrimp on a treadmill. it's not a big deal. >> is a big deal because the way you eliminate a trillion dollar deficit is a billion dollars at a time. the wavy you get a billion dollars is 100 million or $10 million at a time. so what is our excuse? can we say that it is okay to waste money and hundreds of thousands of small areas that add up to trillions of dollars? or do we have to look at big areas? what i would put forward is congress isn't doing their job and how they write it and oversight it. i still pick up any of my feet on the ground because the penny is were 3.5 cents. anyone in america who is struggling today, we don't have the luxury of ignoring stupidity and waste anymore. charles: i have less than a minute. i have to squeeze this in here. you think we could be a
cliff. earlier today, president obama brought the debt ceiling debate, or would be debate into the picture. it feels like a lot of the work that you do -- people say okay, we spent 100 grand on this or maybe watching the shrimp on a treadmill. it's not a big deal. >> is a big deal because the way you eliminate a trillion dollar deficit is a billion dollars at a time. the wavy you get a billion dollars is 100 million or $10 million at a time. so what is our excuse? can we say that it is...
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no matter what happens on the fiscal cliff. and is another bailout nation on the way? student loans up to $1 trillion, huge delinquency rates, default rates going sky high, no credit standards and sky high tuition. sound likes a real bad story to me. ceos have just wrapped up their meeting with president obama about the fiscal cliff and minutes ago john harwood landed a big fish. goldman sachs ceo lloyd blank finefein. >> the highlight of the meeting was the intensity from which the white house emphasized that marge al rates as a matter of math and politics have to go up somewhat, if not all the way to 31.6 had to go up and as p he said as a necessary ingredient of a deal, he would support such a rate. >> the president said we would pursue our own interests. i'm not -- i'm certainly not insisting, i don't even desire higher rates. i think there lab drag if revenue goes up and rates go up. but i think there will also be a drag on the american economy if our budget deficit widens out forever, if we're irresponsible and governor doesn't work. left with those four choices,
no matter what happens on the fiscal cliff. and is another bailout nation on the way? student loans up to $1 trillion, huge delinquency rates, default rates going sky high, no credit standards and sky high tuition. sound likes a real bad story to me. ceos have just wrapped up their meeting with president obama about the fiscal cliff and minutes ago john harwood landed a big fish. goldman sachs ceo lloyd blank finefein. >> the highlight of the meeting was the intensity from which the white...
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you guys are willing to go off the fiscal cliff? >> it republicans are not willing to let rates go back up, and we think they should go back to the clinton levels, a the a time when the american economy was doing exceptionally well, then there will not be an agreement. >> while geithner was drawing a line in the sand, house speaker john boehner was busy trying to lift his jaw off the flar after geithner presented the president's debt reduction plans to him last week. >> i was just flabbergasted. i looked at him and said you can't be serious. i have just never seen anything like it. >> yes, indeed, it seems that republicans are not quite sure what to make of the president taking a harder line across the bargaining table. >> you know, the president's idea of a negotiation is roll over and do what i ask. >> i think we're going over the cliff. it's pretty clear to me they made a political calculation. the president's plan is just, quite frankly, a joke. >> i'm not sure about that, senator graham, but there will be plenty of time for jok
you guys are willing to go off the fiscal cliff? >> it republicans are not willing to let rates go back up, and we think they should go back to the clinton levels, a the a time when the american economy was doing exceptionally well, then there will not be an agreement. >> while geithner was drawing a line in the sand, house speaker john boehner was busy trying to lift his jaw off the flar after geithner presented the president's debt reduction plans to him last week. >> i was...
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he said he would rather go over the fiscal cliff than not to raise tax rates. so obama pushing higher taxes on the top 2%, not for economic reasons but for i'd logical reasons but there is also this obvious fact. obama wants to raise the top rates for political reasons. now that is he wants to force republicans to raise tacks in order to trigger a civil war within the gop and the conservative movement, and in that respect sadly obama is having some success. now so long as this debate is focused not on cutting spending but on raising daxs and revenues with the only question being which taxes, how much revenue, then obama wins. now if obama succeeds in making the argument not about his spending, but about grover norquist, he wins there, too. for republicans, on the other hand, if they can figure out a way to refocus the debate on spending, they win and the country wins. we can't kid ourselves that's correct is not easy to do. obama has the biggest microphone in the land and he also has the media in his hip pocket. all the gop has is control of the house. now it's
he said he would rather go over the fiscal cliff than not to raise tax rates. so obama pushing higher taxes on the top 2%, not for economic reasons but for i'd logical reasons but there is also this obvious fact. obama wants to raise the top rates for political reasons. now that is he wants to force republicans to raise tacks in order to trigger a civil war within the gop and the conservative movement, and in that respect sadly obama is having some success. now so long as this debate is focused...
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the essential components of that right now is to avoid the fiscal cliff and give certainty to the middle class passing those middle class tax cuts rate now. >> you have just articulated what i anticipate we'll hear from the president in the state of the union. the politics of knocking on doors, the good streets politics of the grassroots party. there's greater unit, which is important. >> this election was not just two paths and visions laid out on issues. you had a handful of billionaires on the republican side trying to buy the white house from mitt romney and you had a grass roots movement that was organized from the ground up with volunteers, people-powered campaign. it demonstrated that you can't buy democracy in this country. you really have to work it, and hour voters and supporters were determined to get out their get to work, and stay on line, even with all the obstacles thrown in their way by republicans across the country preventing them from getting access to the polls. >> it's so important. there were two competing advices. in a way this was a good election for democracy. th
the essential components of that right now is to avoid the fiscal cliff and give certainty to the middle class passing those middle class tax cuts rate now. >> you have just articulated what i anticipate we'll hear from the president in the state of the union. the politics of knocking on doors, the good streets politics of the grassroots party. there's greater unit, which is important. >> this election was not just two paths and visions laid out on issues. you had a handful of...
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and, of course, we know that once they go over the fiscal cliff and those that -- that cap cal gains rate goes back to the clinton era it will be a 20% rate anyway. one way or another it's going to up. that's all i am saying. nancy took cook, thank you so much from the national journal thank you for join is us inside the war room. coming up, the car room is is not in the prediction business but we hear there is good money in it. so we are going to jump in. our best guess on how this negotiation will play out right after the break. plus what would thomas jefferson do with the fiscal cliff? funny you should and s author john meechum's new biography on the founder father sheds new light on the man and his method and he, john meechum will join us in the war room. and later mitt romney finally got into the white house don't worry, though it was just for a bowl of chili. ititititititititititititititititititititititititititit before the sneeze, help protect with a spray. before the tissue, help defend with a wipe. before the cold & flu season help prevent with lysol. because when you have 1
and, of course, we know that once they go over the fiscal cliff and those that -- that cap cal gains rate goes back to the clinton era it will be a 20% rate anyway. one way or another it's going to up. that's all i am saying. nancy took cook, thank you so much from the national journal thank you for join is us inside the war room. coming up, the car room is is not in the prediction business but we hear there is good money in it. so we are going to jump in. our best guess on how this negotiation...
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the truth is, the best thing we could do is go over the fiscal cliff. we have the same tax rates that we have when bill clinton was president. significant cuts in defense and also significant human services can you tell us. >> katie, let me ask you, before you respond to what governor dean is saying. there is logic to what howard dean is saying. i don't happen to agree with it. but i know where he's coming from. katie, let me ask you this -- katie can't hear me. we'll wait for her to get back hooked in. howard, what about the notion that i'm posing tonight -- i've said this a few times -- republicans better be careful. they're not going down your road and the democrats aren't going down your road. you have middle class tax cuts for the democrats and it sometimes sounds to me as an old reagan conservative that the republicans better watch themselves because sometimes it sounds like they are kind of defending rich people. that's their whole mantra, just defending rich people. and i think that's not where they should be. >> i would agree. if i were politic
the truth is, the best thing we could do is go over the fiscal cliff. we have the same tax rates that we have when bill clinton was president. significant cuts in defense and also significant human services can you tell us. >> katie, let me ask you, before you respond to what governor dean is saying. there is logic to what howard dean is saying. i don't happen to agree with it. but i know where he's coming from. katie, let me ask you this -- katie can't hear me. we'll wait for her to get...